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Unread 10-02-2008, 07:18 PM   #1
Warrior_Ali
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Default Jumped after years on sub.

Hi guys. I am six days clean off sub. Jumped six days ago and i cant honestly belive how wonderful its been. I do have a little lowe back ache and runny nose for a few hours during the day but i would rather take this all my life then suffer harsh acute WDs.

I was on Subutex for nearly four years, taper by 2mgs every three weeks to a month. Once i got down to 2mgs i scrapped by tiny amounts and alternated. For this made it quicker to stablise and with the minimum of uncomfort. It helps because once you try to stay on a dose you are already use to as you was alternating it with ur everyday dose. By alternating ur everyday dose with the dose ur trying to taper do makes it much easier to go down, well my opinion anyway as it has worked for me.

I know i have yet to be weeks clean and months clean but so far so good. To be honest am not all that shocked as some people before me who were also on long-term sub tapered slowly like i did & didnt suffer too much and are months and years clean. I cant stress how VITAL excercise is, the more sweat u break the more u feel better. If i didnt do any excercise i would actually feely crappy and bored. I dont mean just one or two miles i mean proper, everyday, sure u can have a rest a day or two but everday u take sub then everyday say u shud excercise.

I also skipped days even at the higher doses, the point is to have minumum of sub in ur body when u jump considering the half-life. I honeslty never had a problem tapering. Before i tried to taper fast and and had some issues and actually suffered but i sorted anything out which got me down, even the small minor issues can give u lot of stress when tapering so its best to deal with any thing which gets u down. I also got support from family, hardly any worried or problems and all this made it easier for me to taper. I dont feel any different now then the lower doses and skipping days. I just hope this back ache subsidies soon and am also having to sneeze quite a bit but like i said would take this anytime.

I was probably the only one here and other sites who worried about WDs and PAWS more then tapering lol. As some of u know my fear on WDs and PAWS & taper just became more of a joke and i started to actually laugh about it later and i belive this was also a key part in my successfull taper, i rather joke about it then stress about it. I also have not taken any comfort meds though i do have valium and amititriptyline but i dont plan to use them. I also sleep an hour or two less but still sleep on average 7/8 hours daily so far. I still excercise.

I have a sense of clear smell, like reality has hit in, suppose this is to be expected. I know am only young and in shape but still belive anyone can do this, i cant stress how excercise is important. Just use u r determination and will power which we all have but use it wisley because to me its just about how and when people use this. Sub is not some majic wand, u have to work at ya recovery. Least sub stopped me from doing heroin though i only did heroin here and there on & off for a few years but i still had that addictive behaviour but sub changed that. I know its only 6 days and have a way to go but so far i have not suffered any RLS anxiety, sleepness, depression etc all this i feared many times. All i can advice is to taper slowly (long-termers), keep busy, pray, excercise, be open minded, be the bigger and better person, dont fear, be strong minded hearted and willed. Keep positive, keep busy, try to be nice to evryone and anyone. Try to go bed on time, as its been said early to bed early to rise, geta routine going. I just cant belive how clear things seem now. Its been like this since i was on the tiny doses. Am so glad after nearly four year sub use i made it clean, all that whining, fearing etc has gone right out of the window.

I wanna say thanks to everyone and speacially Mike who always answered any questions i had, your advice and info helped me a lot and i appreciate it that. Am sorry for any mishapes or provokation i caused, it wasnt really me, it was just me confused but thank God am out of that and clean, i just hope its get better from now in. For those who are tapering it can be done, if i can do it and am not exactly Mr. Perfect lol so can u. Be postive, do it nice and slow, dont get angry in things, just go with the flow and excercise much as u can and sort out anything which give u a stress no matter how small. Good luck People.
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Unread 10-02-2008, 07:34 PM   #2
Sam Bailey
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Hey Ali,

As I said to you in an earlier post (elsewhere), you sound really, really good. In fact, you're clear! Clear-headed! You're clear both in your thoughts, and in your expression of them. All due respect, but I couldn't say this a couple/few months back.

And, IMO, it's this CLARITY that will take you a long, long way in your Recovery. You have accomplished a great and good thing, Ali!

Way to go.

Good work, young friend!

Or, as they say in your neighborhood (I think?):

Brilliant!

best,

sam b.
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Unread 10-02-2008, 07:35 PM   #3
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Hi Warrior_Ali, congratulations on your successful taper.

Thanks for sharing your story!

I wish you all the best.
Nancy
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Unread 10-02-2008, 08:04 PM   #4
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Warrior

Congratulations and the best in your future recovery. I am so glad that you got to where you wanted to be and I wish you nothing but the best.

Helen
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Unread 10-02-2008, 08:18 PM   #5
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Warrior_Ali. Congratulations on your taper!

It's amazing how clear your writing seems now. You must feel great, and I encourage you to continue in your great endeavor, and wish you the best of luck in your long term sobriety and recovery.

How did you manage to taper so quickly? Last time we heard from you, a few weeks back, you were at 8mg I believe. What was your method in getting to 2mg so quickly, and then jumping off of it?

Anyway, congrats on conquering your fears of tapering off suboxone....hopefully you are being completely honest!

.........one.............
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Unread 10-02-2008, 11:04 PM   #6
Warrior_Ali
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I started to taper from May this year (2008). I got down to 3mgs quite quick, something like every three weeks to a month, some doses i would stay shorter then others. Sorry i didnt mention my exact taper or progress few months back as i was just concentrating on the taper researching about taper etc, also trying to be prepared and also getting stablising myself . But suppose i should have gave more detail & update when i posted previously.

Thanks for the words guys really appreciate it, i think now i should concentrate on staying clean which i honestly belive i can do. To anyone again tapering or thinking of taperin it can be done. If i can do it anyone can. For long-termers like i was slow and gradual is the way. Use ur stay on sub to deal with any issues, matter small or big and change the addictive mentallity and behaviour. I personally feel i didnt need to be this long on sub but same time i dont belive i wasted my life or anything, infact i can say it saved me so am greatful for that. Excercise much as possible, keep positive, be strong, occupy ur mind and body and like i said go slow. Work with ur Doctor, say u want to taper at ur own pace. Try to cut down on any junk food or fatty food u eat. Maybe am one of the so called lucky ones who dont suffer too much WDs but i dont belive its impossible to get off this for anyone or meth (since they simmilar). Maybe me being in good shape, having time to taper, support, sorting out any issues i had helped me but i think that can help anyone. Maybe my history with drugs which aint the worst also played a part in my detoxing from sub from the minimum of uncomfort. I know i got a way to and its only day 7 but some people have it bad in the first week but all i can think of the WDs i have & got are runny nose for few hours, sneezing, lower back ache (which i had during sub anyway) and reality hitting (duno if it counts as WD lmao lol). But i would take these symptoms anyday for life then the acute which some people get. All the way through i was actually comfortable. I kepy my mind busy, if i did have WDs i didnt notice them because am too busy sorting puzzles out, meaning work, football (soccer), cinema, pool etc all these things can make ur day go faster. Anyway guys will update again. I keep thinking wheni go to sleep is this really happening to me? am i really clean? am i really not suffering any WDs? hope its not a dream and i wake up lol. Maybe if i was in full blown WD i wouldnt be so suprised but am still not shocked or anything as like i said some people have detoxed without harsh WDs. I just hope there are no PAWS for me though i personally belive i wont suffer from them as i never had these anxiety depression sleep etc problems in my life. Whatever i did have like doing heroin here and there (addicitive behaviour) seems to be recitfied while i was on sub so now i have to go through life never touching any opiate/drugs/meds. I think now i should concentrate on qutting smoking as i smoke roll up tobacco lol and i think that should be a touch easier and different to qutting sub lol or maybe harder in a different way but we'll see.
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Unread 10-02-2008, 11:24 PM   #7
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Congratulations Warrior_Ali,

You sound so clear headed and happy. Thank you for posting about your success. Your post will help many other people.

I didn’t have any problems when I quit and I know you will continue to feel good. Keep up that new good outlook and nothing will stand in your way.
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Unread 10-02-2008, 11:49 PM   #8
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Hi Ali,
Honestly when I saw your thread I really assumed you were asking a question about tapering : ) Boy was I ever Wrong - Good for you and congrats ! Do you think you got hung up or paralyzed by the Fear of the drop? Like reading all of the negative stories? I hope it continues to go well for you and I appreciate you taking time to write all of this. I will refer back to it when I make my final jump ! I am really happy for you - you have come a long way ! Isa
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Unread 10-03-2008, 12:04 AM   #9
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Your posts make allot more sense and have better spelling, lol. Well, it's true!! Good luck to you.
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Unread 10-03-2008, 06:21 AM   #10
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Ali,

Hey,,i think yours is a good example of how some of us can become obsessed with the taper and the fear of wd's. You kinda "over stressed" it but Im glad things are working out for you now. Really i am, but i just dont understand how being off of sub only six days made such a difference in how everything seems to be fine with you? Maybe you you were alergic to sub or something? I dont know,,but whatever ,,glad you feel ok now.
Tattoo Tommy
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Unread 10-03-2008, 09:28 AM   #11
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Ali,
Congratulations!! My advice would be to KEEP BUSY. I found distracting myself from any little symptom I was getting was very helpful in the beginning. Also EXPECT some aches and pain, you have stopped taking a strong painkiller so some pain will return. For me it was in my knees and lower back. Eat right and get sleep aids if you need them, insomnia is a common taper symptom and can wear you down. Sounds like you are doing well, congratulations!!
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Unread 10-03-2008, 09:41 AM   #12
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Hey Ali,

Yeah, I know: I've already said this. Several times. But man, I am (nearly) astonished by your newfound Clarity!

Ali? Your posts are so different from what you used to write. So vastly different; and so vastly superior!

What a huge, amazing---and wonderful change.

Keep it up!

best,

sam b
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Unread 10-03-2008, 10:00 AM   #13
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Congrats Ali.
My experience was different than yours,or anybody's for that matter,but like you I was able to utilize a Sub program and put addiction in remission.I also found vigorous exercise to be of benefit in my recovery. Today, almost two years to the day I tapered off Sub,I am in the best physical shape of my life and never crave any opiate. The only long term recurring consequence of my opiate abuse is that I do not sleep nearly as well as I did pre addiction or during active addiction. I feel better after 4-5 hours sleep now than I did after 8-9 during active addiction so maybe it is not a negative at all but I must admit occasionally I would love to sleep in for a couple extra hours but that doesn't work for me.
I agree with Mike that you may now have to deal with some of the normal aches and pains that pain killers have masked but you will not have to deal with the pain that pain killers cause which are far more devastating.
Bill
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Unread 10-03-2008, 02:21 PM   #14
Warrior_Ali
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Hi guys, day 7 nearly completed, the running nose lasted an houre more this time lol, but other then that am doing brilliant. am still excercising, i wud say i lost a tiny bit motivation but nothing major, it seems reality is hitting me but in a good way. Slept 6 hours which i dont mind, i think me skipping days helped a lot, i even did that at thr 4mgs mark too so maybe i gotten use to skipping days and the half-life was coming out so when i jumped i am not suffering too badly. Again i wud these minor symptoms anytime over anything else, i mean who wudnt lol.

Thanks for the words guys, i havent had any pat on the back like this since Slice Bread lol, but u know since am off sub things seem soooooo much cleared i cant belive. I had bit of back ache at upper back this time but again only in the mornings. I am expecting pains here and there but again i will easily take these then depression RLS sleepness anxiety etc.
I think my excericising makes my body tired thats why i get to sleep pretty decent. Am not too concerned about the body pains as i know they will come more but as long i got the strenght to excercise during the day am happy.

Mike, what sleep aids shud i get if i might need them? the Doc wont prescribe any as he is says its best just to let it out and wait for natural enducted sleep which i dont mind as am not having major sleep issues at the momen. I have valium co-odeine and amitytriptyline and also tramdol but these meds have been around my house for a long time because of my family but i dont really belive i will need these or are they for sleep. Any tips for sleep meds? is it better just to get sleep aids from the local health centre then trying to get a RX? again this is all incase as am not even thinking about taking any sleep meds. It feels like sub went out of my system long time ago though traces might be still there but am not concentrating on that am just enjoying life being clean of all opiates.

Thanks again guys. Wish everyone speedy recovery and successfull taper and a wonderful life.
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Unread 10-03-2008, 02:27 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior_Ali View Post

Mike, what sleep aids shud i get if i might need them? the Doc wont prescribe any as he is says its best just to let it out and wait for natural enducted sleep which i dont mind as am not having major sleep issues at the momen..
I used Ambien for about 3 days, but if you keep exercising and if you are getting some sleep you mighty not need any aids at all. You're doing great, the trick now needs to be to keep busy and keep doing what you're doing. Once you're at the 2 week point you'll know if you are out of the woods or not, but it sounds like things are going great so far. Congratulations!!
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Unread 10-03-2008, 02:37 PM   #16
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Warrior_Ali,
CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!! Keep it up even if you have a few rough days or nights, you did it!
Sub
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Unread 10-03-2008, 03:03 PM   #17
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I'll have to agree with Bam. Sleeping well all night long is probably the only thing I may 'miss' now that I've been off sub for 22 months. That could just be my 'normal' but who knows what my normal is after being on drugs for so many years. I have to expect that it's the way it's going to be. And that's ok!!!

See Warrior-Ali, all that constant worry for nothing. Long, slow taper is an easy way to go. It's not the only way but time and time again proves to be the easiest way.

I know we've fought plenty but I want you to know I'm happy for you.

Stacey
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Unread 10-03-2008, 08:36 PM   #18
Warrior_Ali
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Cheers Stacey, i also want to apologise for anything i said, it wasnt really me, it was more of me trying to be clean and find answers so am sorry for everything. Day 8 now and no difference since ive been off sub. Slept 6 & half hours, even my digestive system is in full-swing lol, maybe because i eat a few Bananas and drink lot of Water thats why it helps with my Bowel movements. Also maybe me being in good shape as a lot to do with it but i still belive nobody has to suffer WDs & PAWs, just adjust ur brain and life and u will be fine. I think long-term Sub is better for people with a long history of drug/opiate/pill abuse as it gives u time to change ur lifestyle. For short-term sub in my opinion just solves things temporarly, u need to be clean of ur doc for a considerable amount of time and being use to life without them to be on the Road to Recovery and i dont belive short-term sub speacially for people with long history of drugs will be the answer. Making changed like people, hobbies etc has helped great deal. Its like i dont have anything to worry about thats why i might be having it easy now compared to some people. I know its only been around a week but i would take these tiny minor symtoms all my life then the usual acute WD such as depression RLS anxiety sweats sleepness etc. It feels like a new lease of life, but in a good way. I still enjoyed my time on Subutex lol but i know i would feel much much much better without anything in my system and be sober. Thanks guys for the kind words. By the way any good sleep supplements other then RX anyone know about? again this is just incase as i am not even bothered anymore about sleep as am confident i will go sleep everday because of the excercise i do not just my body but mind aswell.
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Unread 10-03-2008, 09:42 PM   #19
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Well Done Ali!!!
I am truly happy for you.
I applaud your courage knowing how fearful you were.

I wish you continued success in all your endevours.

Best to you always.d
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Unread 10-03-2008, 10:05 PM   #20
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Hi Warrior_Ali, some things that people find helpful for sleep are melatonin (in the vitamin/supplement section of stores); benedryl (an over-the-counter allergy medication); and camomile tea. Also keeping your bedroom dark, cool and quiet - no radio or tv is helpful too.

Thanks for the updates. And best wishes for your continued success.

Nancy
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Unread 10-03-2008, 10:41 PM   #21
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Hi Ali

I have to also agree, you seam to be clearer now, fewer typo's that type of stuff.
I'm so glad you finally made the jump, and are doing well I'll be asking my higher power that it's all wonderful form her on out for you. Keep us posted.

I was going to post about Melatonin but Nancy beat me to it In addition to what Nancy mentioned, I also have had great luck with Doxylamine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doxylamine ) it is found in "Unison" but only the ones in the box, not the bottles. The ones in the bottles are benadryl ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diphenh..._hydrochloride )
Also Valerian Root (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerian_(herb) ).

Also with melatonin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin) you may have to play with the dose I usually take 9 mgs, others I heard take even 15 mg at night, it's very non-toxic in the short term, and I personally took 9 mg a night for like a decade and never seamed to have any side effects. So while the studies are not there to prove it, I bet it safe long term as well. It's one of the few "Non-traditional" or herbal type things that actually seems to work. That and Valerian root, some what, and even goldenseal ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldenseal ) for very mild WD's you have to take a lot though. I seem to be one of only two people who think it helps though.

Good luck, I so happy for your

Smith
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Unread 10-04-2008, 09:10 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior_Ali View Post
i eat a few Bananas and drink lot of Water thats why it helps with my Bowel movements. .
I always thought bananas were supposed to be constipating. lol.

Congratulations on your taper. It is amazing how much different your writing is now that you are Sub free. Makes me wonder if Tattoo Tommy is going to write like William Faulkner after he tapers.

All my best to you.
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Unread 10-04-2008, 09:20 AM   #23
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LOL! Time will tell.

As far as this....
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I always thought bananas were supposed to be constipating.
I think you've been putting them in the wrong end.
Sub
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Unread 10-04-2008, 09:34 AM   #24
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LOL! Time will tell.

As far as this....

I think you've been putting them in the wrong end.
Sub
Lol!! I thought I had the right end as my foot is always stuck in the other.
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Unread 10-04-2008, 09:55 AM   #25
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Hey Codydog,

You wrote,
Quote:
Congratulations on your taper. It is amazing how much different your writing is now that you are Sub free. Makes me wonder if Tattoo Tommy is going to write like William Faulkner after he tapers.
Ha! Too funny. Clever!

best,

sam b
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Unread 10-04-2008, 10:23 AM   #26
So.Cal.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Codydog View Post
I always thought bananas were supposed to be constipating. lol.

Congratulations on your taper. It is amazing how much different your writing is now that you are Sub free. Makes me wonder if Tattoo Tommy is going to write like William Faulkner after he tapers.

All my best to you.
I do alot of reading but i dont know who William Faulkner is,,star treak keeps poppin in my brain,,isnt that the capt?,,so i dont get the joke,,as for my writting changing,,i dont know,,

and Ali,,how many months,(or years) did you spend stressing on tapering off sub? Thats one downside of sub that seems to effect most of us,(worrying about the taper off sub),,i dont know,,this is the first time ive ever been on a maitenence drug or ever had to deal with those worries.
Tattoo Tommy
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Unread 10-04-2008, 03:19 PM   #27
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Quote:
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I do alot of reading but i dont know who William Faulkner is,,star treak keeps poppin in my brain,,isnt that the capt?,,so i dont get the joke,,as for my writting changing,,i dont know,,
Relax, man. No inside joke. Just an observation on your fluid writing style. Faulkner was famous for his stream of consciousness writing style. It was William Shatner who played Captain Kirk in Star Trek. You can read a little bit about William Faulkner here: http://www.olemiss.edu/mwp/dir/faulkner_william/.

Cheers.
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Unread 10-05-2008, 01:27 AM   #28
Smith
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Talking Lol...........

Wow...Sub....That was really the first time I actually LOL on this form.....

Tommy don't worry about it, I can't write wirth a darn either, if you only knew how much work it was for me to write even a small post and it make sense, and not like a child worote it, you'd wouldn't worry. Since you got the info on the other William here is info on Star Trek http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_(1966_TV_series) and William Shatner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Shatner) and if you want the wiki link for William faulkner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Faulkner) You can't trust it (Wikipedia), but it easy to get you started in the right direction. I go along and when I find mistakes I just fix them and sign them, There alway things that someone missed or didn't have as much detail, or something. I had one story someone got form a book, and I had heard it many times directly from the person who did it. It's pretty cool IMO just don't take it as the honest truth on everything.

Smith

Hey Ali,

How are things going today and what day is it for you?
Hope you still doing great, did all you do what quite taking bupe? It seams so different how you write, and I never felt anything form it. If it was just the bupe, how did it make you feel, and what dose did you take and what happened when you went down and/or up in dose and so on? Just tell me/us all about it. Since it doesn't seem to be super common, It will really help if other people come to this site and have the same problem, and think there all alone, and so on, then at least we will of heard of it and know what it's about.

Thanks for sharing your story,

Smith
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Unread 10-05-2008, 08:22 AM   #29
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Tommy,
Live long and prosper....
Chris
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Unread 10-05-2008, 09:49 AM   #30
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Wow,,i read some about him and i dont know about writting but there are some other similarities(sp),,,Im also a short shit,(5ft 6,and try to make up for it with wieght lifting),,and i live in a small town(in arkansas)and pretty much living in poverty.,,and im an artist(tattoo artist and pen and ink drawings),,I may never prosper in other ways but if i can stay out of jail and hospitals and provide the neccesities for my kids and try to make them happy,,then i will feel very prosperous.
So thanks for the links,,interesting,,and Ali, im happy to hear you are doing so well.
Tattoo Tommy
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