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Unread 06-12-2007, 01:17 PM   #1
Kiki2007
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Default Jumping to .05mg...what to expect?

Hi All,
I'm new here and have been reading posts for the past few weeks before deciding to join. Very helpful all around! I have been on sub for a bit over 3 months after a nasty one year addiction to Tramadol. I initially started off at a very small dose-4mg. I have since moved down to 1 mg and just yesterday started on .05 mg. I am already starting to feel a bit anxious and anticipatory of w/d and feeling crappy. I hope to only be on .05 mg for another week and then to completely come off with the help of Clonodine. Just wondering what I can expect on this current dose of .05 mg and when I come off? I have heard that if you are on small doses to begin with my withdrawal from sub may be easier than others...I am just terrified of going through w/d like I did from tram. Also...do I have to taper off Clonodine eventually? Mine, like I am sure everyones goals is to be pill free this summer, and while I dont want to rush it, I would rather go through a few days of feeling s***ty than an entire summer of trying to wean/taper off sub then Clonodine. Any info you can provide would be great! Am very hopeful...thanks All.
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Unread 06-12-2007, 01:36 PM   #2
Suture
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Hi Kiki,
Welcome. Since you only had a one year addiction it shouldn't be too bad. There will be some withdrawal but not as bad as with tramadol. The clonodine will help with some of those symptoms the first week. Something to help you sleep might be useful too. Others that have had done similar tapers and histories have reported minor discomfort, insomnia, general aches and pains, some depression, but nothing bad enough to miss work.

Now if you were addicted for years and years, then 3 months probably wouldn't be long enough of a treatment and you would have lingering withdrawal symptoms for months, but I doubt that will happen to you. After a week or so you should start feeling closer to normal. Just know that anxiety and depression are the symptoms and don't let them get to you, staying busy and knowing they will pass helps a bunch. Good luck!!
S-
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Unread 06-12-2007, 03:32 PM   #3
Kiki2007
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Thanks Suture. Am just wondering if I have to taper from Clonidine too? Am on trazadone now as we speak, have wicked insomina anyways and am pretty much used to that. Have tried Rozerem but that is barely a step above melatonin.
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Unread 06-13-2007, 06:38 PM   #4
RemissionRocks
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do u mean a half miligram or .05mgs? how in the hell can u measure out .05mgs?
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Unread 06-14-2007, 06:44 AM   #5
MakHit
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When I was at .5 I never really held much. I always had to split my dose in two, morning and night, so when it got that low, when I woke up, it was a slow start. I finally went to get the clonodine during that time and that's what helped take the edge off for that last bit. You'll feel sluggish since the clonidine lowers your blood pressure, but it will take the anxiety down. I'd personally try to stay at .5 for at least two weeks and cut down from there. If you feel too bad at the end of the first week at .5, then maybe just jump sooner, but if you feel a tiny bit better after that first week at .5, stick with it another week and go down to .25 the last few days. Sometimes this helps, other times, it's best to just get it over with. Depends on what type of person you are and how your metabolism works. Ohh and I took the clonodine for a little over a week. Tapered off it as well yes. I guess you could go longer but it left me too groggy for what I was trying to do in life. Good luck
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Unread 06-14-2007, 11:42 AM   #6
Kiki2007
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Thanks MakHit. Yes, am doing the .5mg, sorry for any confusion. Definitely feel the anxiety settling in-even though I am on trazadone am only getting about 5-6 hours of sleep a night, and have to take an incredibly hot bath before I go to bed to have any success to fall asleep. Think I am going to call my doctor today to get the Clonidine, am feeling a bit sweaty, anxious, and depressed. Would rather just make the jump off sub next week, feel crappy for a few days, instead of prolonging what is the inevitable. Dont think I will even bother with the .25, its hard enough to cut up to .5!! How long was your taper from Clonidine? Can I expect any anxiety, w/d from that? Thanks for the words of wisdom, I appreciate it
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Unread 06-15-2007, 09:48 AM   #7
MakHit
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I took the clonidine for about a week. People can do it longer if they want, but I used three of the .1 clonidine pills a day the first day off sub, not during sub. Then the sub w/d hit and the edgyness outweighed the couchpotato mode, so I stayed like this a few days, then droped one clonodine every two days till I was on one clonidine at the end of the week. I then staggared the clonodine pill to every other day and then finally to none. This was all a bit over a week I guess. Just the way I did it. Many other's have great information and it depends on how long you plan to use the clonodine. For me, I work in a gym and I would have loved to watch movies for a week and stay on the clonidine till I felt better, but I stoped due to me having to be active rather quick in my work. SO.. I did it fast to try and get back to work as fast as possible. I was a slugggmuffin at work, so this was still from the sub/colodine weeks before, either way you look at it, the sub w/d will make you edgy, the clonidine will make you dizzy and tired on top of the w/d of sub, but clonodine helps a lot to cover some of the bad parts of sub w/d. So you have to really just use your best judgment as to what are the worst symptoms you are feeling and then handling those and accepting the others that come with the territory.
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Unread 06-15-2007, 12:18 PM   #8
Mary
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Hey Kiki2007, it took me a few days to adjust from 1 to .5. Get rid of that anticipatory feeling of w/d and stuff. Keep positive, exercise, eat right, stay hydrated. I didn't have much trouble with the tapering off at all. Here's my and Ros's taper gig, if you're bored sometime.
http://www.naabt.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=522

I stayed at .5 for a couple of weeks and then just stopped. Not bad at all. To me it was more of an annoyance than anything. Much less than being sick with a cold or flu. But the big gig is to stay positive. I learned that earlier in my taper when I started sneezing, and thought oh crap, here it comes, but when I looked outside there was a bunch of pollen and stuff blowing around. Go figure, right?

So, I did it without meds, except for benedryl to sleep.
Big tapering beams to you! -Mary
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Unread 06-15-2007, 12:33 PM   #9
Mike
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I was on 1mg. for about a month when I tapered. The lower I got the longer it took to get adjusted. I tried breaking up the pills but found I could just take them less often instead, and that worked for me. My advice in addition to Mary's would be to stay busy. Being distracted will keep you from obsessing about the little aches and pains you ill get. Remember bupe is a strong painkiller and when its gone you will be able to feel those little aches and pains again, don't mistake them for withdrawal. Good luck!!
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Unread 06-15-2007, 10:25 PM   #10
Stacey
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I was on .5 for quite a while then went to .5 alt with .25---obviously these doses are impossible to do accurately so I just guessed and was not worried about the actual number. At the end of the day it really didnt matter, I was decreasing my dose and was very comfortable doing it. I then started doing every other day at about .25 or .5 and then at Christmas morning I realized it had been a few days since my last 'dust dose' and decided to continue with no sub. I'm still waiting for the withdralwal to start. It was easy. A little bit of sneezing but who knows?? It could have been allergies. I had restless legs for two evenings and that subsided. I used benadryl to help sleep. No problem. It's been more than six months now and life is good.

I wish you luck.

Stacey
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Unread 06-18-2007, 11:21 AM   #11
Kiki2007
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Thanks all for the reply. I'm anticipating making the jump off sub on Thursday when I see my doctor. I have a feeling that she wants me to stay on it longer b/c that also means more money for her right? Already have the Clonidine in hand....feeling ok really now, just some problems sleeping but Trazadone helps a bit. Am up at 6 am on the dot every morning, but have started to work out at the gym which helps A LOT!! I was amazed at how great I felt after working out. Still feel a bit edgy and anxious regarding w/d, but after reading these posts hope it will be somewhat mild and will try and use the Clonidine only as needed and to taper off that as soon as possible. Ill update later this week when I make the jump, am anticipating some uncomfortableness. Keeping busy is important, although the heat in NYC makes me v. sluggish. Its weird, some days I feel fine, others really not great. Guess its an ongoing battle? Thanks all for your kind advice.
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Unread 06-18-2007, 11:31 AM   #12
Kiki2007
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Also wanted to mention that I have 4 Vicodin that I have been holding on to dear life, my initial thought was to keep these in case of emergency and that I somehow would need these to help me through sub withdrawal. Now I realize how stupid that is and just need that extra push to flush them down the toilet. I feel sneaky just having them....but somehow they make me feel better knowing they are there. Could see this starting the cycle all over again...someone push me!!!!
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Unread 06-18-2007, 03:09 PM   #13
wil
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Kiki, my suggestion would be not to rush it right here on the end. If you're comfortable at .5, give it plenty of time from here on so as to be comfortable at zero. After 9 mths on Sub,My gf jumped after being at .5 over 3 weeks. She was a little tired on the 2nd and 3rd day, other than that, she has not had any problems after several weeks now. When you get ready to jump from your .5, why not go an extra week at .5 every other day, may be all the difference you need to make it smooth instead of a little bumpy. Just a thought and I wish you smooth no matter what approach you use. Wil
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Unread 06-18-2007, 04:39 PM   #14
Mary
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Kiki2007, throw out those vics! throw them out, flush them, burn them, pitch them from a moving vehicle into the river, anything! Just throw them out. You don't need that crap lying around especially at this stage of the game. The whole feeling sneaky gig is what we try to get rid of while we're on sub.

One other piece of advice I'll to wil's, is STOP WORRYING ABOUT IT! The more you worry, the worse it will be. Look at me, Stacey, wil's gf, Mike, MakHit, all in this thread. Did fine, no problems. Think that way too instead of being in fear. That'll mess you up.

Throw out the vics. Big beams to you Kiki! -Mary
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Unread 06-19-2007, 08:09 AM   #15
MakHit
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Mary is right about all that she said. I had like 300 vics saved in case of the post-sub emergency just like you. Yeah that's a lot, but I didn't even really want to honestly take them. It was the mental crutch, just like the hard part of letting go of the .5 that you're around now. I ended up learning to be disgusted with the vics. They ruined my bank account, made me fat and lazy, I lost my sex drive and my will to seek out my dreams. Vics are nothing but fat slobs waiting to suck you into their lard filled sexless world. Learn to hate them with these words everytime you see them. To generalize an overall term attached to opiates..... "SOUL KILLERS"

Also, Mary is right about learning how to let go of the fear. The fear is the biggest cause of keeping us crutched up. The fear causes symptoms that aren't really there. Placebo w/d is just as bad as the real and most of the time worse. Once I said, I'm not going to listen to the horror stories or what others have gone through, and just do me.. Meaning, I'll feel how I feel, not how others say I should. Then I also said, if it takes me longer, so what... All of a sudden, a huge weight lifted that the fear was causing. You'll be amazed at what you're capable of once you trust yourself. Don't listen to us! haha.

BUT....do listen to this... Start exercising regularly. Make it a part of your life. Even if you feel very tired and not wanting to do anything, make yourself walk around, push ups, whatever. Then start up'ing your challenge. You'll soon find that exercise will fuel the desire to feel good and you'll be doing it all yourself. With work, but also, better than what any pill could achive. Plus, you'll start to have all of your regular senses' return over time...This is a good thing. =)
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Unread 06-19-2007, 12:03 PM   #16
fegbri
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Kiki, the best thing to do is not go completely off, just increase your intervals between doses. After 1 week on .5, I started taking very 36 hours, then 48 hours, then 3 days, then after about 1.5 weeks, I made it wil NO WD's AT ALL! I think this is what Stacey did as well. No reason to suffer when you don;t have to. I have been off sub for 3 months now, feeling GREAT! Good luck!
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